Time Base Corrector

Started by soetensboy, March 15, 2005, 14:18:01

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soetensboy

Ik kwam op internet de term Time Base Corrector tegen.

Ik zag dat een paar receivers (o.a. Onkyo 602/702) en andere apparaten deze functie hebben.

Wat is Time Base Corrector precies?

Betekent dat ik bijvoorbeeld mijn tv home ontvanger via s-video kan aansluiten op de receiver en dan het beeld via een component kabel op mijn beamer kan aansluiten?
En andersom,  Xbox via component aansluiten op de receiver en dan via s-video naar een televisie?

Ik hoop dat jullie een antwoord voor me hebben, want ik kan het tot nu nergens vinden.

BOUBOU

Hier staat het uitgelegd  :)

Quote
TIME BASE CORRECTOR (TBC) AND/OR SYNCHRONIZER (SYNC)
Courtesy of:  PRIME IMAGE, INC.
By:  William B. Hendershot III, President



Why Do I need a Time Base Corrector (TBC) ?

If you don't have a video tape recorder (VTR or VCR) you don't need a time base corrector (TBC).  However, you may need a synchronizer, which is commonly confused with a TBC.  Definitions and applications of both are explained in this paper.

If you have a VCR you need a TBC.  Consumer VCRs may be excluded - unless used for edit or dub/ then a TBC is needed.

Without VCRs, which generate time base errors in television pictures, there would be no need for time base correctors.  Put in other terms, if VCRs and video tapes were mechanically perfect, there would be no time base errors to correct -- but like the world and all that is in it, perfect does not exist.  TBCs are needed to electronically make television pictures played back from imperfect VCRs and tapes as near perfect  (stable)  as possible.

What Is Time Base Error?

It is mechanical error or change.  In the case of video tape,  the errors are introduced by temperature,  humidity,  drag and tension changes which alter the physical size or shape of the tape at the time of playback versus these same parameters at the time of recording.  In the case of the VCR these are errors introduced by mechanical size, shape and condition of the tape path, which changes the physical size and shape of the tape at the time of playback versus these same parameters at the time of recording.

Changes in size or shape of video tape smaller than one thousandth (1/1000 of an inch on a day-by-day VCR to VCR basis is nearly impossible -- electronic control of these mechanical errors in a TBC is nearly perfect.


What Does Time Base Error Look Like?

It manifests itself as geometric distortion in the television picture playback.  The most common type of time base error shows up as a bent or curved line in what should be a straight vertical line in the picture monitor (visualize a flag pole with bends in it -- the TBC makes the pole straight again).  Sometimes the time base error changes as the tape is played back, causing the bends or curves to change shape or wave back and forth.  The top of a picture played back from a VCR is almost always displaced to the right or to the left due to time base error. The TBC removes this displacement.

Do You  Need A TBC?
Is Your VCR Perfect?

1.   TBCs make clean edits possible by locking the VCRs to the same external sync generator.

2.   A sync generator and a synchronizer (SYNC) are two different pieces of electronic equipment.

3.   All high quality TBCs have built-in sync generators which reinsert clean H-sync, V-sync and burst on the video signal.  For example all Prime Image TBCs have built-in sync generators with clean H-sync, V-sync and burst at both output ports.  This is just a side benefit from a TBC that  is needed anyway.

The Super TBC
In the beginning there was a time base corrector (TBC) and then a synchronizer (SYNC).
First There Were Time Base Correctors (TBC)
These TBCs made electronic news gathering (ENG) possible by removing small rapid time base errors from smaller, less expensive VCRs. In 1973 Consolidated Video Systems (CVS) introduced the world's first digital TBC which stabilized errors from these smaller, less expensive VCRs,  so they would meet FCC broadcast requirements and ENG was born.  CVS received the Emmy for this pioneering work.  These early digital TBCs were 10 1/2" D and 19" rack mountable; they sold for about $10,000 (over $20,000 in today's dollars).
Then Came The Synchronizer (SYNC)
These SYNC units locked remote feeds to local station sync making possible clean switches, fades, splits, etc. between local and remote non-synchronous picture sources. This was accomplished by removing large slow time base errors from microwave, cable and satellite feeds.
At the 1974 NAB Show both CVS and NEC introduced the world's first digital synchronizer (SYNC). These early SYNCs were 7' H, 30"D in 19" racks, running off of 220 volts and selling for about $80,000 (over $150,000 in today's dollars).
And Now The Super TBC  (TBC/FREEZE-II)
At first the TBC and SYNC were clearly two different products. Now they can be combined to form a Super TBC which removes rapid time base errors from VCRs and at the same time provides V-lock by removing slow time base errors from non-capstan servoed VCRs.
Example:
The (TBC/FREEZE-II (50-II) from Prime Image, Inc.  is a Super TBC providing both full frame synchronization and time base correction in a                      1 3/4" H, 16" D, 19" rack mount unit for under $2,000. The 50-II also provides frame and field 1 or 2 freeze, and frame and field strobe effects while consuming less than 20 Watts at 110V.
These Super Full Frame TBCs (50-II) make possible true A/B roll edits between non-capstan servoed (non-V-locked) VTRs.  The resultant output is true interlaced phased color even when the VCR playback is only heterodyne color.
From TBC to SYNC To Super TBC (50-II)
less power
smaller size
lower cost
more features
Digital Effects In A TBC or SYNC
Since TBC and SYNC equipment convert the TV picture to the digital domain to accomplish their basic function, it requires few additional parts and therefore very little additional cost to provide digital effects within these same units.  TBC and SYNC units are needed to meet FCC Broadcast requirements and digital effects are desired in many cases.  Some manufacturers provide TBC and SYNC units either with or without digital effects -- they choice is yours.
All TBC Digital Effects are possible in a full frame SYNC plus various full picture freeze and strobe effects. Full proc amp should always be included.
1.    Freeze frame:  entire full 525 line TV picture is frozen in a full frame digital memory.  A frozen frame  yields the best possible vertical resolution.  Note:  A TV frame consists of two TV fields  (262 1/2 lines).
2.    Freeze field:  in quality SYNC units field #1 or #2 can be frozen.  Usually in these units the full frame is frozen and field #1 or #2 can be selected to display as a frozen picture.
Note:  A frozen field has only half the vertical resolution of a frozen frame; however, a frozen field can be used to remove flicker from a frozen frame created when a picture with moving objects is frozen.  Therefore, A SYNC with both frame and field #1 or #2 freeze yields the best of all worlds.
3.    Strobe:  a strobe effect is created  by repeatedly freezing the incoming TV picture.  The strobe or freeze rate should be variable from real time to a fixed frozen picture.  Both  strobe frame and field should be available to create the most desired variation of strobe effects.
Other Considerations:
1.    Multi Channel:
   The Multi-II provides from 1-to-10 Channels of TBC and SYNC in one    3U high rack mount unit with full monitoring capability and front    panel control of up to 32 parameters per channel.  Also controllable    through a 232 port or Model #R-1 remote.
2.    Component/ Transcoding:
   The C-SYNC is a full frame SYNC/TBC with Component (YRB), Y/C    and Composite in/out and full transcoding between all inputs/outputs.    Up to 32 parameters can be controlled from the front panel of this 1U    high rack mount unit for under $3,000.  Also controllable through a    232 port or Model #R-1 remote.
3.    2-Channel, A/B Roll Editing:
   The Model "TWO" is a dual channel full frame SYNC/TBC specially    designed for A/B roll editing.  The "TWO" is in a 1U high rack mount    frame with full controls on the front panel, controllable through a 232    port or Model #R-1 remote.
4.    TBC/SYNC on a PC Board:
   The "Xpon" is a transcoding component (I/O) full frame SYNC/TBC    on a 12 oz. board that will plug into any computer with an AT-Bus.      The "Xpon" exceeds all broadcast specifications with true component    (YUV) capability.  Over 32 parameters on the "Xpon" can be    controlled through the computer or through a hand held remote.

MvGr. BOUBOU
Marantz SR7300--NAIM NAP-175--3x NAIM NAP-150--NAIM NAP-250--Wadia 6 CD--Mission E83 front--Sonus Faber Solo center--Sonus Faber Concertino rear--Klipsch THX5002L Atmos--Aurasound NS-15 zelfbouwsub--SVS PB2000 sub

soetensboy

Bedankt voor dit stukje BOUBOU, vind het wel redelijk moeilijk te begrijpen, vandaar nog een vraag.

Quote van bovenstaande tekst:

2.    Component/ Transcoding:
The C-SYNC is a full frame SYNC/TBC with Component (YRB), Y/C    and Composite in/out and full transcoding between all inputs/outputs. Up to 32 parameters can be controlled from the front panel of this 1U    high rack mount unit for under $3,000.  Also controllable through a 232 port or Model #R-1 remote.

Wil dit zeggen dat ik het op onderstaande manier kan aansluiten?

tv home ontvanger via s-video kan aansluiten op de receiver en dan het beeld via een component kabel op mijn beamer kan aansluiten?
Xbox via component aansluiten op de receiver en dan via s-video naar een televisie?

Alvast bedankt.

BOUBOU

Het lijkt mij op het eerste gezicht een scaler.
Ik heb hier echter geen ervaring mee, mischien dat iemand anders er meer over kan vertellen  ;)

MvGr. BOUBOU
Marantz SR7300--NAIM NAP-175--3x NAIM NAP-150--NAIM NAP-250--Wadia 6 CD--Mission E83 front--Sonus Faber Solo center--Sonus Faber Concertino rear--Klipsch THX5002L Atmos--Aurasound NS-15 zelfbouwsub--SVS PB2000 sub

soetensboy

Zag op deze site de specificaties van de Onkyo 602

http://www.onkyo.net/uk/cms/products/home/av_rec/TX-SR602E/indkey.htm

Daar staat o.a. in:
Component Video Upconversion with TBC (Time Base Corrector)

Heeft dat te maken met het switchen van s-video naar component en van component naar s-video?

BOUBOU

Als het al op die receiver zit, en je wilt een crt projector gaan gebruiken, dan is het mischien wel de moeite waart.
Als je hem er appart bij moet gaan kopen voor onder de $ 3000 dan zou ik nog even verder zoeken  ;)
Mischien toch nog even vragen bij een eventuele dealer.

Upconversion is in weze toch het zelfde als upscaling  ???

MvGr. BOUBOU
Marantz SR7300--NAIM NAP-175--3x NAIM NAP-150--NAIM NAP-250--Wadia 6 CD--Mission E83 front--Sonus Faber Solo center--Sonus Faber Concertino rear--Klipsch THX5002L Atmos--Aurasound NS-15 zelfbouwsub--SVS PB2000 sub

soetensboy

Ik zal de situatie even uitleggen

Ik ben dus op zoek naar een nieuwe receiver voor mijn HT die tevens het volgende kan:

Xbox en dvd via component en tv home ontvanger via s-video aansluiten op de receiver.

En dan met een component kabel naar mijn Infocus X1
En met een s-video kabel naar mijn breedbeeld.

Is dat mogelijk met die Component Video Upconversion functie? Zoals de Onkyo 602 heeft.

BOUBOU

Een S-video ingang voor tvhome  zal de receiver vast wel hebben.....

Volgens mij kun je de rest met een component switchbox  ???
In dat geval ben je niet speciaal aan de Onkyo 602 gebonden  :)
Ik hoop dat het zo klopt

MvGr. BOUBOU

Marantz SR7300--NAIM NAP-175--3x NAIM NAP-150--NAIM NAP-250--Wadia 6 CD--Mission E83 front--Sonus Faber Solo center--Sonus Faber Concertino rear--Klipsch THX5002L Atmos--Aurasound NS-15 zelfbouwsub--SVS PB2000 sub

soetensboy

Nou bijna,

De s-video ingang van mijn Infocus X1 is bezet door de S-video to Component adapter. Dus ik heb alleen nog een video aansluiting over en daar wil ik tv home niet mee aansluiten.

En ik wil graag xbox op mijn beamer en op mijn tv kunnen spelen, zonder draden te hoeven verwisselen.

Wat ik nog niet helemaal uit je verhaal opmaak is het volgende: kunnen de eisen en wensen die ik heb met die Onkyo 602 reveiver nou wel of niet?

Alvast bedankt

BOUBOU

Quote from: soetensboy on March 15, 2005, 16:45:09

Wat ik nog niet helemaal uit je verhaal opmaak is het volgende: kunnen de eisen en wensen die ik heb met die Onkyo 602 reveiver nou wel of niet?

Alvast bedankt

Daar kan ik je helaas geen antwoord op geven  :-[
Er zijn vast nog wel andere mensen op het forum die er meer verstand van hebben  :)

MvGr. BOUBOU
Marantz SR7300--NAIM NAP-175--3x NAIM NAP-150--NAIM NAP-250--Wadia 6 CD--Mission E83 front--Sonus Faber Solo center--Sonus Faber Concertino rear--Klipsch THX5002L Atmos--Aurasound NS-15 zelfbouwsub--SVS PB2000 sub